Episode 13: When Rest Feels Wrong
What Rest Deprivation Reveals About Our Culture (and Ourselves)
How to Reclaim Rest, and Quiet the Self-Sabotage Spiral
Summary
Ellen reflects on a truth many of us avoid: rest isn’t easy. In fact, for a lot of us, rest feels wrong—like we're breaking an unspoken rule. In this solo episode of Hard at Work, Ellen unpacks the layers of grind culture, internalized productivity pressure, and the self-sabotage that shows up when we finally try to slow down.
She kicks off the episode by answering an AMA question from a listener who's struggling to maintain boundaries on a leadership team that never stops working. What do you do when the people around you treat 2 a.m. emails like a badge of honor, and you’re trying not to burn out? Ellen offers practical scripts, reframes, and real talk about what's actually in your control—and what's not.
From the influence of capitalism and white supremacy on our inability to rest (shoutout to Tricia Hersey and Rest is Resistance), to simple tools to shift out of survival mode (thank you, Britt Frank and the “DEFUSE” method), Ellen invites listeners to look honestly at what keeps them busy and what they might be avoiding when they resist stillness.
Whether your weekends feel like a second shift or your rest comes with a side of guilt, this episode will help you name what’s happening and offer ideas for doing things differently—without shame, and without apology.
Takeaways
1. Boundaries only work if you protect them—especially when no one else is.
Even in high-pressure environments, you can model healthy work norms, communicate your availability clearly, and hold the line—even if others don’t.
2. Grind culture isn’t just exhausting—it’s systemic.
Our discomfort with rest isn’t a personal failing. It’s a result of capitalist and white supremacist systems that profit from our overwork and disconnection from ourselves.
3. Rest feels wrong because we’re conditioned to avoid it.
If you feel guilty or anxious when you try to rest, that’s not a character flaw. It’s a sign you’ve been trained to ignore your body and productivity has been overvalued.
4. You don’t have to suffer to be valuable.
Quiet, stillness, and silence aren’t indulgent—they’re healing. You can (and should) rewire your brain to feel safe while resting, using techniques like Britt Frank’s DEFUSE method.
5. You can challenge toxic norms with micro-experiments.
If your workplace isn’t ready for big change, pilot a new boundary for yourself or your team. Track how it impacts your well-being—and bring data to the conversation later.
Notable Quotes
"You’re not broken—the system is."
"Rest isn’t lazy. It’s resistance. And for many of us, it’s revolutionary."
"If rest makes you feel wrong, ask who taught you that—and who benefits."
"We’re not just avoiding naps—we’re avoiding being alone with our thoughts."
“The world doesn’t want you to rest. Rest anyway."
Chapters
00:00 – Intro & Six Months of Self-Employment
01:15 – AMA Question: Holding Boundaries When No One Else Does
03:00 – Why Norm-Setting Feels Risky When You're the “Only”
04:45 – Option 1: Talk to Your Boss or Team About Norms
07:00 – Option 2: Quietly Set and Communicate Your Own Boundaries
09:30 – Option 3: Do It Silently and Report Back Later
12:40 – When None of It Feels Safe: Considering Other Options
14:30 – New Theme: Why We Self-Sabotage (Starting with Rest)
16:00 – The Weekend That Isn’t Restful
17:30 – Grind Culture, Capitalism, and White Supremacy
19:15 – Rest as Resistance: Tricia Hersey & The Nap Ministry
21:40 – The Guilt of Stillness and What It’s Really About
23:30 – Britt Frank’s DEFUSE Method for Moving Out of Survival Brain
29:10 – Real-Life Example: Sitting in the Pickup Line
32:00 – Calm, Silence, and the Science of Doing Nothing
34:30 – You’re Not Broken—The System Is
36:00 – Final Thoughts and Gratitude
Keywords
grind culture, boundaries at work, toxic work culture, burnout recovery, workplace burnout, self-sabotage at work, emotional labor, capitalism and overwork, rest is resistance, Tricia Hersey, workplace norms, leadership boundaries, white supremacy and rest, DEFUSE method, Britt Frank
Links:
Tricia Hersey and Rest is Resistance, Rest Deck, the Nap Ministry
Transcript
Ellen Whitlock Baker (00:02.476)
Hey everyone, and welcome to a new solo episode of the Hard at Work podcast. I'm recording this today on June 2nd, which is actually the six month anniversary of me leaving my nine to five and launching this whole working for myself thing, which has been a journey. And it's just, it's a really big deal to me that this is month six and I'm still pinching myself that this is my life.
totally comes with a lot of stress about fear, about money, and a lot, a lot, a lot of managing myself through big changes, which are really effing scary. I've been working super hard on getting curious with myself about why I'm feeling like I couldn't or shouldn't do something because there's this deeply ingrained stuff that's having me put up roadblocks to myself. So I've been thinking about all that.
and in conversations with some of my recent guests and friends, I'm seeing more and more that we're often our biggest enemies. So I want to take the next few solo episodes to dig into that a little more, to uncover why we're self-sabotaging, how we can heal from doing it, and how we can push back against a system that often wants us to think badly of ourselves. But first, I have an AMA at work question that fits perfectly into this theme to tackle today.
It's been a while since I've done one of these. So if you're new here, first, hello. And second, the AMA about work is an anonymous form on my website where anyone can submit a question about their workplace and I might answer it here on the podcast. I like to keep plugged into what's happening in your workplace as we speak and try to help you parse out solutions to some of the things you're feeling like you can't talk about or ask about at work.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (02:02.314)
So this question is, I work on the executive team with about six other leaders. I am very diligent about my boundaries and try not to work after work hours or on weekends. The problem is that none of the other executives do the same. And I don't feel like it's safe for me to ask for us to create a norm around it. It's also keeping me out of the loop. If they email after 5 p.m. and once at two in the morning and again at 6 a.m.
I'm already three emails behind when I log in at 8 a.m. So how do I protect my boundaries in a workplace where no one else does?
This is a great question and I'm betting a lot of you have or have had a similar challenge at work. I certainly have. And I'm thinking back to something that Kira Mauseth said in episode eight, that the leader has to model the behavior they want from their team. So she talked about if you tell your team not to email after hours, then you need to do the same. If you work after normal working hours for any reason,
schedule your emails to send so no one is getting them at 2 a.m. if that's when you happen to be working. And yes and amen to this practice for your own team. But what if your leader isn't modeling this at all? Your boss. So this is tough. I mean, especially for those of us who are already feeling like we're not fitting into the workplace.
speaking from my own experience, it can be really, really vulnerable when you don't fit the mold. Like if you're the only one on your leadership team with a school-aged child, which happens to a lot of us, for example, if you're the only one on your leadership team with a school-aged child, which happens a lot, you have to miss more than the other executive team members do.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (04:02.882)
or choose to miss school plays, games, time with your family, et cetera. I'm also thinking back to our episode with Greer Procic and how to navigate the workplace with a disability, invisible or visible. And again, you're already needing a different level of support or way of working than the quote unquote norm. So it feels hard to ask for more on top of that, which is totally bullshit.
but is also the way it works in a lot of our workplaces. Still. So here are some thoughts. I'll give you a few options that come to mind. So first, if you have a good relationship with your boss and or the other members on the executive team, I think you can call this out. You know, as we've learned on this podcast, keep to the data and present like a scientist. So, hey, I'm noticing that a lot of us are actively working after working hours.
And I agree that you should work when it's most convenient for you and that sometimes we need to catch up at night or on the weekends. And I'm trying really hard to keep my work and life relatively balanced because I know that's what I need to be the strongest I can be at work. So what's tricky for me is if I follow this general rule of not working after hours or on weekends, I find myself behind the ball when others have had full conversations during that time.
Would you be open to us discussing some norms about working after hours that we could agree on to make us feel more comfortable? So that's one option, you know?
Ellen Whitlock Baker (05:45.688)
Tell it like it is, use data, explain why, and ask. Now, if this feels tricky for your whole team, start with just your boss. Again, if you feel like you have a relationship with your boss where this is a kind of conversation you can have without harm to you. So you could even tie it to your outcomes. Hey, I work best when I'm not spending my off time working.
I understand that there are things we need to do after hours that are time sensitive, but I wonder if we could set some norms around general practice of emailing after hours. Here's how that would help me. Blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it's really expensive and time consuming to rehire someone, so they really don't want you to leave and will likely do what they can to keep you. So it's okay to ask for what you want.
And I'm thinking back to an Anita Crofts trick that we learned in episode 12, which is, can we pilot this for a few months and check in on X-Date to see how it's working for both of us? That's a great option and very reasonable to ask for. So if you're...
worried about asking for big changes to the norms of the workplace culture, you can ask for piloting a small new practice, which is maybe nobody sends emails between 8 p.m. and 6 a.m. or something like that and see how that goes and then check in and see how everyone's feeling about it and make sure that you set that date to check back in on because that will make sure that you know you have this
and your boss know that you have this timeline and you can actually have the conversation about whether it's working or not.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (07:39.948)
So that's sort of option one, which is tell the truth, talk about it, see if you can change the norms. Again, this is for workplaces where you feel like this is a safe conversation to have. So in option two, if it doesn't feel safe to have those conversations, which it sounds a little bit like our initial question asker is kind of in that space. And I want to say here, safe is different than comfortable. So.
These conversations can be uncomfortable, especially if you're someone who doesn't really like conflict or like standing out in any way. But there's a difference between discomfort, where you're pushing yourself a little beyond your comfort zone to grow and being safe. So I just want you to think about that, but make sure that if this feels like an unsafe situation, don't feel like you have to do anything because it's...
dangerous for you at work to speak up in an unsafe environment, unfortunately. So leaders, if you're listening, try not to make unsafe environments. And that's what this whole podcast is about. option two, if it's not feeling safe, you can create your own norms and let everyone else know what they are. You say, hey, I'm gonna be offline from 5 p.m. to 7 a.m. every day.
and totally offline on weekends unless we have an event. If you want to reach me during that time for an emergency, you have my cell phone number. So we talked about this a little bit in the boundaries episode. Tell them what you're doing. And we talked about it in the context of setting that norm for your team, but you can also set it for your peers and your leader.
And you can share if it's something you're doing with your whole team and you're going to see how it goes for a few months. You know, like, Hey, my team needs a little more balance right now. I really am committed to keeping them here. I know you are too. They're doing great work. So I'm going to try this norm of not emailing between five and seven and see how it works for a couple of months. So there you go with that pilot again. and I'll let you know how it goes.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (09:59.084)
it's gonna go well. I'm pretty sure. And there's so many studies out there that show that overwork causes burnout and causes people to leave and that Gen Z and younger millennials are leaving the workplace in droves because of this sort of grind culture. So you can actually quote some science about why this is an important thing to do.
And then option three is you can do it on the down low. So don't make any announcement about it and just be okay with the outcomes. So in this case, you know, and the original question asker, I think is kind of doing this already. You know, you don't work after hours if you can help it. And you know why you're doing this. It's a really powerful reason. You want to preserve your home time and you know, you do a better job when you're not working over your hours for the week. So work when you work and answer emails when you answer them. And if a bunch of decisions or conversations have happened online during non-working hours, you can get to a place where you're okay with that because you can't control when other people work. And even if you set these norms, sometimes you still can't control. I mean, you're never gonna control what other people do. So what you do have control of is yourself.
So you can do some internal work to feel okay about the fact that this is happening and you're not participating. And everyone else on that leadership team is a different person and they're all approaching their leadership roles with different lived experience and work experience and what's going on at home. So you're all seasoned professionals and you know what you need. So I'd say follow your instincts and weigh in during work hours and model that to your team because that's the really important thing.
And you can do this for a few months. And if you feel comfortable, report back to your boss, say, hey, we've been following this norm for about working after hours and we still hit all of our goals. So I'm wondering if we can have this conversation with the leadership team again. So I'm wondering if we can have this conversation with the leadership team as well. Right? So you're kind of doing the trial without telling anyone. What is that called in science? I can't remember, but you're doing this trial and then you're reporting back when you have positive results. Now, if you have negative results, obviously there's something else going on. So definitely dig into why that isn't working for your team. There's probably a lot of other things happening.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (12:40.406)
And look, if you're in a place where you feel like you can do none of this, I'm just going to tell you that's a shitty workplace, which you probably know. And I know how easy it is to feel trapped somewhere for all of the reasons, but it might be time to consider what's next. And have that coffee with someone that you've been wanting to have coffee with that you haven't talked to for a while and works at that company you really want to work at or...
tweak your resume or take a few steps in the direction of looking for something new. And then when you start your new job, you can be really clear about your boundaries from the get-go and make sure that whatever environment you're walking into is one that respects those boundaries. So there you go. It's definitely a hard question. If you're in a place where you're, sorry, it's definitely a hard question. I'd love to hear what you all think. Please send me a message on LinkedIn or Instagram.
or email me at ellen at ewbcoaching.com if you've got other good ideas. I'd love to share them. And please submit your own AMA.
Send me a message on LinkedIn or Instagram or send me an email at ellen at ewbcoaching.com. If you've got other good ideas, would love to hear them and share them on here. And please, I will love it if you would submit your own AMA and sounds like y'all are liking these. So keep those questions coming in.
you can send them to ewbcoaching.com slash ama hyphen about hyphen work. So hopefully you will do that. I'll put a link to that in the show notes. and I think also if you just Google EWB coaching, AMA about work, you should be able to find it, but God knows. So I hope to hear from you soon. All right. So now we're on to today's topic, which is the theme of
which is involved in the, which is part of this theme of how we self-sabotage often without realizing it. So today what I want to talk about is how hard it is for us to rest. And the example I keep thinking of is how we spend our weekends not resting. So here's how my weekends went when I was really feeling on the ball and was working my nine to five. I would clean the whole house one of the days, which would take three hours or so.
Do all the laundry, fold it, put it away, grocery shop, meal prep, have boring but really important conversations with my spouse about our finances or whatever, go to whatever kid activity was happening. Usually I'd have a work event, I'd work out, and maybe I'd have dinner with friends or family. But if I was hosting, I'd be running around making sure that everything was good and making the food and setting the table and, and, and.
actually just like saying all that is exhausting. So no wonder I did not feel refreshed on Monday mornings. And if I spent my weekends doing something else like reading or hiking or traveling or camping, I'd feel really guilty that I didn't do all the other things or feel like I had to work extra hard when I got home from whatever fun activity to do all of the things, not rest. So like spending time resting, like just
Ellen Whitlock Baker (17:01.334)
resting, you know, not doom scrolling on my phone or numbing out with a TV binge or resting but tidying, if you know what I mean. I don't know how to do that. I didn't know how to do that. So if this sounds familiar, I feel you. And I think there's some things for us to think about together, because I am learning along with you. So first, one of the things I've discovered
during my burnout recovery is that rest feels like I'm doing something wrong. And this is so typical in our culture. If you want to get real about it, it's because lots of people profit from you not taking care of yourself. Capitalism is real and it really is what drives a lot of our culture. And the more you rest, the less money that companies make. And I need to bring up a really important connection here between our grind culture that makes us feel like rest is bad
It's rooted in, it's rooted not only in capitalism, but in white supremacy. So Trisha Hersey, who's the founder of the Nap Ministry and the author of Rest is Resistance, talks about rest as a form of resistance to white supremacy and capitalism, especially for black people whose rest has historically been denied or devalued. So.
I'm learning from Trisha Hersey's work that grind culture isn't just exhausting. It's rooted in these systems of oppression that benefit from keeping us disconnected from our bodies and each other. And it's been on my mind a lot and I thought I'd share in case you weren't familiar with Hersey or her work. And I highly recommend reading her work to educate yourself on this. I'm doing the same right now.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (18:52.078)
Speaking of Hersey, she has published a really excellent tool for when you're having trouble finding that rest, which is called the Nap Ministry Rest Deck. And my coach Aiko sent me the deck and I love it. It's full of these cards that are like tarot cards almost that can guide you in what Hersey calls resistance to grind culture. Each card has a quote on one side and a rest practice on the other and they're beautifully illustrated by Paula Champagne. I'll put a link to this deck and Hersey's books in the show notes for you. And a reminder that
there's a lot of complication that goes with talking about grind culture when you are someone who is experiencing that as a white person. And I am learning this from Trisha Hersey and others. So when I talk about it here, it's definitely something that we all feel the effects of and that I want to help all of you resist because it's better for everyone when we do.
but I really want to acknowledge again that that grind culture is specifically and especially detrimental to people of color and black people in particular.
I tell you all of this to tell you that there are a ton of forces beyond your conscious thought that are making you feel like you're lazy if you don't spend your whole weekend cleaning and cooking and doing laundry or feel like you can't take a short nap in the sun or are really uncomfortable with just being without doing. And it's really hard to unlearn that and resist it. But now you know if you didn't already that
There are forces at work out there in the universe that really don't want you to rest. And knowing is half the battle. If any of my other 80s kids who watched GI Joe after school are out there, you'll recognize that. So that's the first thing I want you to think about, which is this world doesn't necessarily want you to rest. And so you're working against some really big oppressive forces and it's not your fault that you can't rest in many instances.
The second thing I wanna talk about is I want you to think about why you might be avoiding being quiet. So this one's a little harder to admit, but was certainly true for me and may or may not be true for others, but I've talked to some other people who blah, blah, but was certainly true for me. So we are so rarely quiet, truly resting.
in any given day. mean, think about your day to day and think about how much time did you actually spend in quietness, mindfulness, going on a walk without your earphones on, sitting and enjoying your coffee in the sun, whatever it is for you. Think about how many times that happened. For me, it's usually zero. And I'm working on it being one or two. So.
Sometimes I think what we're doing, or at least what I was doing, and still am doing, if I'm honest, is subconsciously avoiding managing my feelings. Because those feelings come up when I am quiet. So those alone and quiet moments are really rare for me. And when I was working in an office, I was really rarely home alone.
And so when it happened, I kind of panicked, honestly. Like I can remember at least a couple of occasions where I'd sit on the couch and listen to the quiet and then immediately get up and start some big projects because I couldn't handle it. Or if I stayed on the couch, would numb myself with TV or doom scrolling or whatever. And this isn't to say that you can't sit on the couch and read a book or watch TV or binge a show or whatever, but it's...
If you're only doing that and not getting any of those mindful moments of quiet, you could be avoiding some things. So your brain, remember, it's keeping you safe at all times. Not happy, not emotionally regulated, not peaceful, safe. It's protecting you. And guess what letting yourself feel those feelings is? It is potentially unsafe.
And so your brain is going to want to protect you from that. And the little alarm bells might go off like I have to keep myself busy because if I don't, I might think about something that makes me feel, you know, sad, mad, angry, unsafe, different, different than this norm.
And we are in these perpetual states of stress response right now and in general. Like our brain is already on survival mode from the constant stressors in our life, like that shitty email you got at work today or your project that's not going on time or, god, I forgot to make those doctor's appointments again, or maybe the general total shit show the world is right now. That is really true.
troubling and problematic and scary for most of us. So, you know, stuff like that, right? So when you're stuck in that survival brain, and again, very understandably if that's where you are stuck, because look at all the things you're having to wield in a daily basis, on a daily basis. But when you're stuck there, you know, that peace, that quiet, that rest, it's not gonna come unless you shift your brain out of survival mode, which can be really hard.
but it's not impossible. That's one of those simple but not easy things that we talk about all the time. So I have a great resource for this. I'm reading Britt Frank's new book. It's excellent. It's called Align Your Mind. And you may have heard me talk about Britt before her book, The Science of Stuck is one of my favorites as well. Total rock star, highly recommend. But her new book is about your shadow parts and how you can actually talk to them.
in order to understand them better. And that is a gross oversimplification of an excellent book, but for this purpose, I think that works for what you need to know. And she describes in the book how you need to get out of survival brain and into a mindful state in order to observe your thoughts rather than fusing with them, which is kind of what's happening when you're in that stress response. And if you hear mindful state and like me panic because
I have a hard time thinking I am going to be mindful now and then trying to be mindful. My mind races. I can't meditate. Yoga can be hard for me. You know, all of those things. Like if you're not good, quote unquote, at finding that mindful time, again, my friends, don't beat yourself up. It's also part of this culture that makes it hard for you to do that. And it takes a lot of practice I'm learning. I'm a lot better at it now.
six months after I left my job than I was when I was still working in my nine to five. So I just want you to go easy on yourselves and don't get scared by the word mindful. So Britt Frank, the author of this book has this really great acronym to help you diffuse from survival brain. And the acronym is DEFUSE. D-E-F-U-S-E. So to get out of that perpetual fight, flight, freeze, fawn state that we're in often,
she recommends using this diffuse acronym. So the D is describe your physical sensations. The E is exit the room. F, feel your body. U, use your senses. S, shift. And E, exhale. And she has a disclaimer, which I'll read here about exhale. She says, there are times when breath work is problematic for your nervous system. This is a thing. If, sorry, let me try that again.
She says there are times when breath work is problematic for your nervous system. This is a thing. So if counting or forcing breaths doesn't work, don't do it.
So, DEFUSE. I'll put a link in the show notes to the book and see if there's a diagram or something about the acronym that you can look at so you can kind of see it in motion and understand it. But let me give you a real life example of using DEFUSE from a recent point in my life. So I was driving to pick up my kid from school the other day and I forgot my phone.
I usually use that time to listen to a podcast, to learn how to do my business better, or listen into an unedited episode of this podcast so I know what to tell my editor to fix. Hi, Charlie. But I had no phone. And the radio was on NPR, which was immediately stressful because it was about babies in the NICU and I just, couldn't. So I turned it off. And as soon as I sat there in the...
waiting for my kid in the pickup line, I experienced this massive wave of an anxious feeling. I didn't know why or what it was. It just came up as I was sitting there. So past Ellen would have analyzed this to death to try to get to the bottom of why was I feeling this way, which is a deferral tactic from actually feeling whatever it was I needed to feel.
So to use Britt's diffuse tactic, here's what I would have done. D, describe my physical sensations. So I would have said, huh, I feel like my throat is closing a little and my heart is fluttery, but not in the good excited way and I'm feeling hot. No judgment, just observation, right? E, exit the room. So in this case, I couldn't actually exit the room because I was driving a car.
But it's a great next step from Britt. So if you are in a position where you can leave the room, it can really help your brain realize that you're not needing its help to survive right at that moment and you're okay.
feel your body. She suggests things like tapping your face or squeezing your toes. You know, in the car I could have easily done some face tapping or I often rub my hands up and down the front of my thighs when I'm sitting like, you know, an athlete that's warming up my quads before a race. It's calming for me. So that physical touch can ground you back away from that survival. You use your senses.
So Britt talks about the five, four, three, two, one method, which I love, which is name five things you can see, four things you can touch, three things you can hear, two things you can smell, and one thing you can taste. And I find this a super helpful technique, especially when I'm in places like a doctor's office where I'm nervous about something and the wait is really long and I feel that anxiety kind of bubbling up. This tactic works really well for me then.
S is shift. So that made me think of Kyle Elliott's episode, which is episode two of this podcast. If you haven't listened, another one for you to go back and listen to if you like. But Kyle talked about how he and his partner will physically brush off negativity. They'll go outside on their balcony and brush negative things off of their body, which I absolutely love. So.
In this context, the S in diffuse is shift. It's about moving your body. So you can do that. You can brush things off. You can shake your arms and legs. You can dance. You can go on a walk. I could have easily done some brushing off in the car, no problem. The E in diffuse is exhale. And what Britt says is when you exhale longer than you inhale, you engage the brain's relaxation response.
So she suggests breathing in a one to two ratio. So if you inhale for two counts, you exhale for four. And reminder, don't forget her disclaimer about breath work that I read at the beginning.
So I find that to be really helpful advice on how to get yourself out of survival brain. If that's what's keeping you from taking that moment of stillness or rest that you so desperately need to regulate your nervous system and get the rest, that real rest that you need to restore yourself to continue on with all the things that you do. And take another expert's word for it.
Calm.com is an expert. This is a great quote from their website. One study found that two minutes of silence can be more relaxing for the body than listening to relaxing music. Silence has also been linked to lower cortisol levels, reduce blood pressure, and even changes in the brain. Specifically, quiet can lead to increased activity in the hippocampus, which is the part of your brain that handles memory, learning, and emotional regulation.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (34:25.826)
So basically when you're just sitting there doing nothing, your brain might be making new connections or even fixing itself. I don't know if I love the word fixing, but you get the point. So my friends, I hope that you walk away from today's episode with a few things. I hope that you know that if you have trouble resting, actually resting, you're not alone. And in many ways, it's not your fault. And again, I will tell you.
you're not broken, the system is. And I hope you understand a little more about the reason why the world doesn't seem to want you to rest and instead preaches this grind culture and that you understand more about the connection between grind culture and white supremacy and capitalism and that you go out and buy and read Trisha Hershey's book, Trisha Hershey's book, Rest is Resistance to learn more. And
I hope you can think a little bit about what you might be avoiding if you're not good at sitting still. So use Britt Frank's diffuse tool to help to get yourself out of that survival brain mode if that's keeping you from really resting and restoring and by Britt's book too, it's great. So as always, these opinions are my own.
and please take them all with a grain of salt, use what's useful, don't use it, whatever works for you. My purpose on this podcast isn't to tell you what to do, it's to help you learn what I have learned and am still learning about our toxic work culture to help you both resist it and change it if you want to. So thank you, thank you, thank you for listening. I so appreciate all of you. It's...
It's been really, really special to get messages from you telling me that you're resonating with the podcast. I usually cry when I get one of those messages in a good way. So please reach out. Tell me what you're liking, what you're not liking, who you want to hear from, anything. You can reach me at ellen at ewbcoaching.com. I'll be back with another solo episode next week exploring more of why we self-sabotage.
Ellen Whitlock Baker (36:40.236)
and how we can reclaim living joyful lives and resist all of the forces that make us think that that's impossible. So until then, keep up the good work and you're more awesome than you know. So until then, keep up the good work and remember that you're more awesome than you know. See you next time.
